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Topic: Tempo Training Tournament

king_of_nowhere
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Joined: 2014-09-15, 18:35
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Posted at: 2020-04-26, 22:26

niektory wrote:

king_of_nowhere wrote:

also, congrats niektory! it's been a long time since someone managed to best worldsavior at anything in this game.

Alas, he was still better. As Boromir would say, one does not simply best WorldSavior.

you got two times out of five better than he did.

I know i don't play often, but I haven't seen him lose a single game or any single point of an economy tournament since 2016.

the-x wrote:

Well played Niektory - how did you achieve these dream times, since we rarely played in mutiplayer before i am very surprised to see these outstanding times, beating world and me in Frisian

How? A spreadsheet to account wares, identification of bottlenecks, heavy use of the PageDown button, extreme micromanagement, and multiple tries. I can't play this way in multiplayer so I'm much weaker there. ;)

and that's why i didn't try to hide my times. i don't have the patience for that level of optimization, and i figured someone would beat me to it.

speaking of multiplayer, i will try to host a regular tournament this summer.


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alasiaxx
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Joined: 2020-04-26, 05:07
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Posted at: 2020-04-26, 22:46

Hello everyone,
I also had a go at the tournament, not to compete with others so much as to work on improving my own times. I figured I'd post to encourage other less experienced players to take part and enjoy the challenge for the sake of it.
I'll admit though that it was satisfying to produce an Empire hero at 39.57 last week when the then best published time was 42.03!

My times are as follows:
Barbarian: 44.24 on bzr9220

Empire: 36.19 on bzr9220

Atlantian: 29.57 on bzr9220

Frisian: 57.10 on bzr9278

I've not played with the Amazons - compiling Widelands on my ancient systems has proven to be an exercise in frustration. Obviously, no save games attached since this is my first post here, and the competition has concluded anyway.

Edited: 2020-04-26, 22:51

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hessenfarmer
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Joined: 2014-12-11, 23:16
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Posted at: 2020-04-26, 22:51

king_of_nowhere wrote:

speaking of multiplayer, i will try to host a regular tournament this summer.

great news. And again many thanks to our current host.


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the-x
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Joined: 2019-01-19, 13:23
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Posted at: 2020-04-26, 23:21

Edited by kaputtnik: Removed content after some discussion with the-x. He wanted to do it himself but couldn't do so somehow.

Edited: 2020-04-27, 19:26

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the-x
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Posted at: 2020-04-27, 00:44

I just searched for the last four missing replay files it was a lot of work since replay folder only saves numbers and from time you can only guess and it is nearly impossible for those if you tested balance / played a multiplayer game. Solution: automatic replay files with more details and not only numbers, with time it was possible to search for them


Attachment: missing replay files.zip (730.3 KB)

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hessenfarmer
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Joined: 2014-12-11, 23:16
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Posted at: 2020-04-27, 09:26

niektory wrote:

king_of_nowhere wrote:

also, congrats niektory! it's been a long time since someone managed to best worldsavior at anything in this game.

Alas, he was still better. As Boromir would say, one does not simply best WorldSavior.

Don't be to modest. You have been the big surprise of this tournament, outdoing him in 2 out of 5 is really a reason to be proud of.

the-x wrote:

Well played Niektory - how did you achieve these dream times, since we rarely played in mutiplayer before i am very surprised to see these outstanding times, beating world and me in Frisian

How? A spreadsheet to account wares, identification of bottlenecks, heavy use of the PageDown button, extreme micromanagement, and multiple tries. I can't play this way in multiplayer so I'm much weaker there. face-wink.png

May I ask if you could provide us with this spreadsheet in the balancing thread. As it really might help to see where we could achieve the most with the least invasion in game.


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blind3rdeye
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Joined: 2020-03-26, 08:47
Posts: 46
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Pry about Widelands
Posted at: 2020-04-27, 10:10

king_of_nowhere wrote:

32:27 with barbarian. always amazon 6762.

theoretical best time with barbarians is 31 minutes. that's the time it takes to build a metal workshop, work it long enough to gain a master blacksmith, upgrade it to war mill, and build the 5 axes needed. i made the metal workshop as my first building, it always worked, and still i got the last axe at 30:30. add in the time for road transport and promotions.

I was thinking about this last night; and I notice that you had a follow-up saying that you could improve the time by upgrading a second metal-works while the blacksmith gains experience. It occurs to me that it might be possible to improve even beyond that. Please correct me if I'm wrong; but as I understand it, the cool-down for metal working is on the building itself, not the worker; but the experience is on the worker, not the building. So you can increase the rate at which your worker gains experience by having two metal-workshops next to each other, and kick the worker out whenever they finish a cycle. (So that instead of waiting for the cooldown, they just walk to the building next door and start working again immediately.)

I've been playing some 'poor hamlet' / 'struggling outpost' starts recently, and I've used this trick to speed up wood-cutting. I'm not certain if it will help in a tempo-tournament though. One issue is that for the technique to work, the second building must remain vacant while the first building is working; and so the player might have to do some other shenanigans to prevent the second blacksmith from getting to the building. It could be easily done by building a third metal workshop; but at that point I suppose we have the risk of running out of starting resources!

In any case, my point is that I think the hard-minimum could still be a bit lower. (So then, now you all have my secret strategy, and I'm sure someone will use it to win in a future tournament!)


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the-x
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Joined: 2019-01-19, 13:23
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Posted at: 2020-04-27, 10:58

good idea

Edited: 2020-04-27, 16:41

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the-x
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Posted at: 2020-04-27, 11:03

The exact problem is: Opend with the version in the table they are staying in pause mode - if you push accelerate it works till exactly min 1:00 and then the game crashes and is back to desktop


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niektory
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Joined: 2019-06-03, 20:06
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Posted at: 2020-04-27, 16:20

hessenfarmer wrote:

May I ask if you could provide us with this spreadsheet in the balancing thread. As it really might help to see where we could achieve the most with the least invasion in game.

Not sure if it'll be useful, but OK. Attached.

the-x wrote:

The exact problem is: Opend with the version in the table they are staying in pause mode - if you push accelerate it works till exactly min 1:00 and then the game crashes and is back to desktop

They work fine for me. Are you sure you're using the right version? Here's the Windows build for the bzr9220 version.


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