Currently Online

Latest Posts

Topic: Major problem with game strategy

TomasM
Joined: 2009-04-10, 08:38
Posts: 4
Ranking
Just found this site
Posted at: 2009-04-10, 08:58

After reading review on LinuxJournal, I tried this game and I think it's pretty interesting, but while playing second tutorial campaign I discovered what I would call a strategy bug. There is a way to become invincible.

What you should do is this:

  1. In the beginning of the game expand your borders very fast by building sentries/barracks. Especially is beneficial to expand to a direction, where you would expect your enemy to appear. When you will decide, that you captured enough land and resources, build some basic structures (lumber mills, etc.) near the borders (to make sure, that borders will stay).

  2. Burn down all your military structures, that you were using for expansion (again especially those near the side of you opponent).

That's it, now you are invincible. Even if your enemy will come to your borders with huge army and would place tower near the border, he would not be able to spot any military building, that means he would not be able to attack you.

Possible solution: make all buildings available for attack. That would also give you an opportunity to weaken enemy's economy, before making final attack.

Also would be nice to be able to have zero (0) solders in military buildings.

Good luck!

Edited: 2009-04-10, 09:00

Top Quote
Nasenbaer
Avatar
Joined: 2009-02-21, 18:17
Posts: 829
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: Germany
Posted at: 2009-04-10, 10:32

Well I actually don't get the point. Perhaps I missunderstand you, but from what I read, your plan is to:

  1. Burn down the military buildings at the frontier

  2. set some other non military buildings at the frontier

But if that is your plan - you won't succed face-wink.png

The point is, that only military buildings can hold up the military influence on an area and so any enemy military buildings built near your frontier will burn down your non military buildings and conquer the land.

So as I wrote: Perhaps I missunderstand you - but I see no problem there.

Cheers Peter


Top Quote
SirVer
Joined: 2009-02-19, 15:18
Posts: 1440
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: Germany - Munich
Posted at: 2009-04-10, 12:55

Welcome to Widelands!

Military influence works differently as in Settlers II. You're complete land will burn down as the enemy builds additional military building at his borders.

Cheers, !SirVer


Top Quote
TomasM
Joined: 2009-04-10, 08:38
Posts: 4
Ranking
Just found this site
Posted at: 2009-04-21, 17:45

Sorry for late response.

My understanding of the game was somehow wrong. That was caused by the map of tutorial campaign, were the way to enemy city was blocked by big field of stone.

Anyway I think the logic that only military building may be attacked is wrong, because:

  1. I can attack enemy's military buildings and my soldiers would go trough the stone field or forest, etc.

  2. Once military buildings would be burned, soldiers would return and after that I would not have a chance to attack any other remaining buildings in my sight.

  3. I can not burn them with my military buildings, because they are too far. And I cannot build any new structures because the stone field.

  4. The only solution is to crank up the game speed to 100x and wait for your workers to gather all stone, so that way additional space for new military buildings would be created.

In my opinion this is really wrong for the RTS game. I can imagine playing a campaign this way, but what you would do playing with real human opponents? Is there a way to increase game speed in multi player? Anyway for me it's a real deal breaker which makes game less realistic and too long.

Edited: 2009-04-21, 17:47

Top Quote
SirVer
Joined: 2009-02-19, 15:18
Posts: 1440
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: Germany - Munich
Posted at: 2009-04-21, 18:20

Thomas, Widelands is not Starcraft. Widelands games go for hours. When you have attacked your enemy, you have to build a new military building to advance. This leaves the enemy time to reorganize it's economy, maybe build more military buildings or moving soldiers around. And usually you have other things to do too (check for mines, advance in other directions).

I'm sorry that it is a deal breaker for you, but we won't change the essence of the game.

Cheers, !SirVer


Top Quote
Nasenbaer
Avatar
Joined: 2009-02-21, 18:17
Posts: 829
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: Germany
Posted at: 2009-04-21, 20:46

well actually the map you are talking about really has a 'problem' (if you like to name it that way) with that stone wall - that's basically a problem based upon map design ...

when I created that map, there wheren't enough possibilities to set up the AI to simply stay on that part of the island, so I simply blocked his way out face-wink.png

I think that might be fixable nowadays.. perhaps I'll find some time to take a look at it in next days/weeks

Anyway SirVer is absolutely right: this is not StarCraft ... Widelands is much more a economic game than most other RTS face-smile.png


Top Quote
TomasM
Joined: 2009-04-10, 08:38
Posts: 4
Ranking
Just found this site
Posted at: 2009-04-22, 06:14

Of course it's up to the taste, but anyway you guys are doing great job with this game and one day it will be full featured game face-smile.png

Good Luck!


Top Quote
TomasM
Joined: 2009-04-10, 08:38
Posts: 4
Ranking
Just found this site
Posted at: 2009-04-22, 16:41

Accidentally I found interesting toppic on Wesnoth forum. Apparently there is a programmer, who wants to create Setlers II clone. Some user already suggested him to join Widelands project, but he was not happy with the look of interface. I though you could create discussion with him and perhaps your projects would have another passionate programmer face-smile.png

http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=24560

And last word before leaving:

There are couple of interesting projects:

http://opengameart.org http://search.freegamedev.net/ http://wiki.freegamedev.net/index.php/Media

http://forum.freegamedev.net/

http://graphics.simutrans.com/index.php?cat=10003

where you could get good quality graphics / music for your game!

Edited: 2009-04-22, 17:07

Top Quote
SirVer
Joined: 2009-02-19, 15:18
Posts: 1440
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: Germany - Munich
Posted at: 2009-04-23, 08:33

Hey Thomas,

That's at least the third project that want's to create a S2 like game. The thread you posted wants to do a 3D Game, which we specifically do not want to do.

Thanks for the links!


Top Quote
Phazorx
Joined: 2009-06-05, 13:02
Posts: 4
Ranking
Just found this site
Posted at: 2009-06-05, 13:20

On original subject - i do find that current influenece border/military control area schema is exploitable.

Examine followinf scenario:

  1. Expand towards enemy reaching some passageway (i was using dry riverbed map

  2. Pick bottleneck shaped region created in a way that enemy will be disadvantaged by only having limited space for building while you have wider area.

  3. Destroy military buildings at the border.

  4. Fill border area with rangers/foresters.

In my case a single lumberjack (actualy i could have placed there 2 of them but AI wasnt smart enough) were dealing with 4-5 rangers. Obviusly, since rangers had some major handicap on time LJ was unable to make enough progress to make room for expansion. AI also does not like to remove it's military buildings at frontier and wasnt ging to replace them with LJ huts so situation was a complete stalemate.

It is less of a problem with MP gam since another player can occupy area with flags and roads as well as building quickly over new trees withing borders but it could be annoying at least.

Perhaps limitting rangeres/farmers do deal only with ownland might be goo idea? Same should apply to harvesting professions as well imho.


Top Quote