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Topic: Report Frisians Playing

Fresenius
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Joined: 2018-08-26, 09:45
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Pry about Widelands
Location: Germany
Posted at: 2018-09-15, 10:15

Thank you, GunChleoc, for the kind offer, but I think that those who know everything better about Frisians are best qualified to perform such an update. As was justifiedly pointed out, I don't belong in this class! face-wink.png I surmise there is some "spiritus rector" of this invention, and he or she would be the right to make it, just in case they were interested.


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Fresenius
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Joined: 2018-08-26, 09:45
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Pry about Widelands
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Posted at: 2018-09-15, 10:25

If I may mention something, in my latest version of the game I can't find the ominous "mission", probably an introductory mission, in the overview of the campaign screen. So what I'm saying is that I don't have access to the Frisian campaign (though I had been interested and was searching).


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hessenfarmer
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Joined: 2014-12-11, 23:16
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Posted at: 2018-09-15, 12:32

Fresenius wrote:

If I may mention something, in my latest version of the game I can't find the ominous "mission", probably an introductory mission, in the overview of the campaign screen. So what I'm saying is that I don't have access to the Frisian campaign (though I had been interested and was searching).

the campaign system works in a way that the next mission / campaign is made visible after you have successfully completed the previous one. Meaning you have to have completed the Atlantean campaign to see the Frisian campaign. Of course this can be cheated and you can play the missions directly. (one way is to edit the campvis file in the save folder).
BTW: which version do you have


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hessenfarmer
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Joined: 2014-12-11, 23:16
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Posted at: 2018-09-15, 12:55

Fresenius wrote:

Thank you, GunChleoc, for the kind offer, but I think that those who know everything better about Frisians are best qualified to perform such an update. As was justifiedly pointed out, I don't belong in this class! face-wink.png I surmise there is some "spiritus rector" of this invention, and he or she would be the right to make it, just in case they were interested.

Hi Fresenius, I really would feel sorry if the discussion left you behind with a feeling not belonging to the group to discuss the frisians. Sure you do. As you could have seen from just the few posts there are still some points where users having discussed this for quite a while don't agree. But if so we would not need a discussion. Only thing is that some things already have been discussed intensively.
in the beginning everything started with this topic https://wl.widelands.org/forum/topic/2888/
After having achieved some basic maturity we had some different tradeoff discussions. Mainly about balancing Which is more than having balanced soldier stats. see following topic https://wl.widelands.org/forum/topic/4232/
So although there has been so much discussion there is still things to discuss. So perhaps some answers were based on an information advantage from people who discussed this for a longer time. From my side it was never meant or intended as to show "knowing it better" or disqualify your posts and arguments. It was just meant to explain why things are as they currently are. (which does not mean they could not be altered).

Best regards hessenfarmer

PS: If you miss some information on the homepage this might be due to the frisians are still on heavy development.


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Fresenius
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Posted at: 2018-09-15, 15:40
> *hessenfarmer wrote:*
>
> the campaign system works in a way that the next mission / campaign is made visible after you have successfully completed the previous one. Meaning you have to have completed the Atlantean campaign to see the Frisian campaign. Of course this can be cheated and you can play the missions directly. (one way is to edit the campvis file in the save folder).
> BTW: which version do you have

I can come in here and file my gamer's dislike of such a setting! It makes more sense if there are as many campaign strings available in the menu as there are tribes in the game. Within each string then there is progress in availability of several missions (ideally speaking). That's what I would expect and, though my memory is only faint, I believe in other games with comparable setup this has also been the case. The user then has the choice with which tribe he wants to make first experiences, or selectively may skip some. So, if you'd ask me, I'd vote to change it! :)

My program version was of around 1st of September.
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hessenfarmer
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Posted at: 2018-09-15, 18:06

Ok, as far as I know the reason was that this was originally designed as having the barbarians as "tutorials" but as these have been moved to dedicated scenarios, this is not a very strong argument anymore. Taking into acccount the hopefullx still increasing missins per tribe I would be in favor of your suggestion. This would then mean we have the first mission of each tribe visible from the beginning. Please create a new topic to discuss this here as the title of this discussion is not so telling to have a couple of votes. this could be implemented easily for b20.

for the future it would be helpful to reference the BZR version or the version displayed in game to hunt or reproduce bugs for example, cause we have currently 5 to 6 commits each day so around 1st september is quite a big range of versions / commits.


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Fresenius
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Joined: 2018-08-26, 09:45
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Pry about Widelands
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Posted at: 2018-09-16, 10:54

If it appears critical, I will mention the exact version, all right! I am currently playing the first mission of the Frisian campaign. If you don't find it invasive, I could offer to report here what points I stumble into or what my experiences are. Is this of interest for the designers?


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hessenfarmer
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Posted at: 2018-09-16, 14:08

In my opinion every feedback is valuable. So feel free to report what you like.
Please be aware that the frisian missions as well as the tribe are designed for advanced players. They are supposed to be difficult and it is not improbabale you will not win in the first attempt. Read the messages carefully to get some hints about tactics that are useful to manage them.

BTW: I will start a new branch of frisian balancing isuues today where I will incorporate your sugesstion of reducing helmet costs.


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Fresenius
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Joined: 2018-08-26, 09:45
Posts: 12
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Pry about Widelands
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Posted at: 2018-09-17, 09:25
Well - I start with handling / surface issues.

1.a - I don't really like the new scope display button on houses. First I don't see any bad in the immediate area display when the site is clicked. Why should one bother? So the result of this button for me is only I have to perform another function to see it, that seems superfluous. In case people find it compelling, there is an improved solution if you make the button a toggle. That means for each type of house or just global the setting can be clicked once but you wouldn't have to click each time you open a site.

1.b - the font is too small for the scenario messages. I had a screen setting of 1200-ish to 800-ish, if that makes any difference. Difficult to read the text.

1.c - the tabs of ingame overview menus (Inventory etc.) should be remembered. For example, I don't like to click on the third tab all the time when I open Inventory because that's the table of information I'm interested in. It makes a lot of sense to remember the latest choice.

1.d - I was missing a history of the scenario messages. The idea is that the entire messages of the scenario or mission progression should be available for reopening at a later time. Perhaps this can be added to the tasks window where one would expect such a feature.

1.e - I found the Frisian Broadsword image a bit too faint, e.g. in the listing of the Arena. For a while I wasn't sure whether there were items in the slots because they appeared as placeholders in my interpretation. Perhaps the contrast could be made heavier or/and the hefts painted in some color so it's clear these swords aren't greyscale.

Don't hesitate to comment and criticize!
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Nordfriese
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Joined: 2017-01-17, 18:07
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Posted at: 2018-09-17, 09:56

Thanks for the comments face-smile.png

1a – The work area used to be visible by default, but it was changed recently because many players disliked that

1b – That depends on your screen´s dpi; fonts appear smaller on high-resolution screens. I think someone is working on making it possible to customize the font size; until then, it´s sadly not possible to improve that face-sad.png
Or perhaps you could hack the data/scripting/richtext.lua and other rt-related functions and play with the font sizes there to try to fix at least some texts…

1c – that would be nice to have!

1d – it would certainly be useful, but my vote is -1. I prefer that people have to read carefully and memorize everything that could be important. That way, if some character happens to drop a remark that will be important later, you´re at an advantage if you remember everything. Reading the history is cheating face-wink.png

1e – all swords already have coloured hefts, but I admit the broadsword´s is a bit faint (it´s light blue). I´ll make the colours stronger in my branch


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