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Topic: Set hill-terrain when modifying hight

kaputtnik
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Joined: 2013-02-18, 20:48
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Posted at: 2014-11-12, 18:25

It takes a lot of time, to set the right terrains to hills. It would be great, if hill-terrains are automatically applies to all terrain, that would be higher than the origin hight. Maybe there could be an Option "Set Hill terrain automatically" to the hight tool?

So if want to make hills i could decide to set the appropriate terrains automatically. Other terrains, like snow, water or lava could be set afterwards.

For me this would bring some benefits: 1. I could better see, where hills begins. Sometimes this is not so easy. 2. Making maps would be more faster and efficient


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GunChleoc
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Joined: 2013-10-07, 15:56
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 19:20

Sounds like an interesting idea. If more map editors want this, I'll add it to the wishlist.


Busy indexing nil values

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Tibor
Joined: 2009-03-23, 23:24
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 19:43

Alternative aproach - setting terrain based on altitude (height). I mean you would pick a range of heights and terrain


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wl-zocker
Joined: 2011-12-30, 17:37
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 19:46

I am no real fan of the proposed idea. The default height is 10. If I want to avoid totally flat terrain, I usually use a random height between 10 and 12-14 (depending on how buildable the area should be). I usually do not want this terrain to be mountains. If mountains only start at height 15 (just an example), this would be rather opaque.

I would like to suggest the other way round: When you place mountain area and then click on a button "Make mountains", the height is automatically adjusted. The algorithm could work as follows: For every mountain field (at least four adjacent mountain-like terrain types), calculate the shortest distance (let's call it d) to a non-mountain field. Then, the new height is something like old_height + f(d). f(d) is a function that looks like sqrt(d) and represents the mountain shape. Maybe we could also create different types of mountains (f(d) = d, or a logistic function).

Two issues that come to my mind:

  • Multiple usage: With every click, the mountain gets higher because the old_height is always added. Possible solution: Do not use the old height, but interpolate based on the mountain ends. I have no idea how to do that in detail.
  • Small buildable spots: Sometimes, it is necessary to place small spots on a mountain where buildings can be built, or just to make it look more realistic. The fields would maybe stay unchanged and result in weird mountains (with holes). Possible solution: The terrain of these places is mostly the mountain meadow. There could be a special treatment for it (it normally does not count as mountains, but when there are enough (whatever that means) mountains around it, it does count as a mountain).

"Only few people know how much one has to know in order to know how little one knows." - Werner Heisenberg

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kaputtnik
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Joined: 2013-02-18, 20:48
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 20:24

wl-zocker wrote:

I am no real fan of the proposed idea. The default height is 10. If I want to avoid totally flat terrain, I usually use a random height between 10 and 12-14 (depending on how buildable the area should be). I usually do not want this terrain to be mountains. If mountains only start at height 15 (just an example), this would be rather opaque.

Thats why i proposed a clickable Option in the height window. So you could decide when or not the hill-terrain is automatically set. In case of making random heights to reduce the buildability you turn of "automacally set hill terrain" and everything is ok.

Such an Option would bring the old behavior and new benefits.

I would like to suggest the other way round: When you place mountain area and then click on a button "Make mountains", the height is automatically adjusted.

Hmm, areas are just qudratic, aren't they? In case they are. this would result in many "mark area -> Make mountains" clicks if i want to make a mountainchain. E.g. make mountains along a coastline.


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GunChleoc
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 20:29

Actually, areas are triangles. You can arrange 6 triangles around a flag to form a hexagon.


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wl-zocker
Joined: 2011-12-30, 17:37
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 20:38

Thats why i proposed a clickable Option in the height window. So you could decide when or not the hill-terrain is automatically set. In case of making random heights to reduce the buildability you turn of "automacally set hill terrain" and everything is ok.

I do not know how other people work, but speaking for me, I will never use this feature and therefore all time spent on it would be wasted.

Hmm, areas are just qudratic, aren't they?

I think I did not express clearly what I imagined: You place mountain terrain like you currently do (hexagonal). When you have finished with all mountains, you click on "Make mountains". This option works globally and changes the height of all mountains that are on the map. There is no need to select a special area (in Widelands, there is no such selection at all). This is also the reason why it is so bad to click on that option multiple times: When all mountains are ready and you add another one and want the new mountain's height to be adjusted, all other mountains change, too.


"Only few people know how much one has to know in order to know how little one knows." - Werner Heisenberg

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kaputtnik
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Joined: 2013-02-18, 20:48
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Posted at: 2014-11-13, 21:08

Ah... i've got it. Instaed of automatically setting the hill terrain, your proposal is to

  • first set hill terrain at the height of 10
  • by clicking on "make mountains" the height is automatically set

This sounds to be a good idea face-smile.png


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