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Topic: Problem with worker requests

Nordfriese
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Posted at: 2020-07-03, 19:45

If an economy target is set to > 0, then the ware will be produced if and only if the total amount stored in warehouses is strictly less than the target setting (regardless of existing requests).
By setting a target to 0, you enter "produce-on-demand" mode: The ware will be produced if and only if it is requested somewhere.

Worker requests are being correctly cancelled when the target building is destroyed or gets a worker from somewhere else. The translations from worker requests to tool requests is done in the Economy.


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JanO
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Posted at: 2020-07-04, 08:27

Nordfriese wrote:

By setting a target to 0, you enter "produce-on-demand" mode

Not very intuitive.
I would vote for making zero a real zero and putting the "produce on demand mode" to -1. Then mask the -1 with a less misleading icon.

Edited: 2020-07-04, 08:27

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Tribal-Chief
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Posted at: 2020-07-04, 10:10

JanO wrote:

Not very intuitive.
I would vote for making zero a real zero and putting the "produce on demand mode" to -1. Then mask the -1 with a less misleading icon.

It is very intuitive as I see it. Set to zero means do not produce any wares for stock. If a request is created for something not in stock then a request to produce the item is created.

The main problem currently is a worker requst is made to a warehouse which then creates a tool request. If the worker request is cancelled for any reason the tool request is still left active and a tool will be produced for stock. Handling the request chain in code is much better than creating new states in the UI, together with rewording help texts, tooltips etc.


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teppo
Joined: 2012-01-30, 09:42
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Posted at: 2020-07-04, 10:11

JanO wrote:

Nordfriese wrote:

By setting a target to 0, you enter "produce-on-demand" mode

Not very intuitive.
I would vote for making zero a real zero and putting the "produce on demand mode" to -1. Then mask the -1 with a less misleading icon.

Could you imagine that when request arrives, the amount of wares (stocked minus reserved) becomes negative, and producer attempts to bring it back to zero.


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JanO
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Posted at: 2020-07-04, 15:31

No, I cannot imagine that. I guess it is more likely that code produces an error for wrong type of variable than that. The "-1" is only a name I chose to visualize how to enter that state. I still think that setting the stock to zero should imply a production ban.


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Nordfriese
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Posted at: 2020-07-04, 19:41

Perhaps the following interpretation is more intuitive? If a ware is needed somewhere and we don't have enough in stock, it will be produced. Always. If we don't need a ware, it will be produced until the desired amount is being stored in warehouses.

A production ban would not be useful most of the time IMHO so I don't see the need to implement that.


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hessenfarmer
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Posted at: 2020-07-04, 22:13

Nordfriese wrote:

Perhaps the following interpretation is more intuitive? If a ware is needed somewhere and we don't have enough in stock, it will be produced. Always. If we don't need a ware, it will be produced until the desired amount is being stored in warehouses.

A production ban would not be useful most of the time IMHO so I don't see the need to implement that.

me neither. I believe the settings is explained well in the Tutorials, so it should be clear what it does.


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GunChleoc
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Posted at: 2020-07-06, 08:27

Tribal-Chief wrote:

The main problem currently is a worker requst is made to a warehouse which then creates a tool request. If the worker request is cancelled for any reason the tool request is still left active and a tool will be produced for stock. Handling the request chain in code is much better than creating new states in the UI, together with rewording help texts, tooltips etc.

That's what I gleaned from my work on this feature so far and where I want to go with addressing the issue.


Busy indexing nil values

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kaputtnik
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Posted at: 2020-07-07, 19:53

I have played now a whole game with all economy settings set to zero, and it works nicely.

Main reason why this works nicely are:

  1. Most construction sites needs a lot of time to be built. In this time the needed wares are created.
  2. Production sites have a stock in themselves, and if this stock isn't full of resources, the needed requests are made but the production does not stop.

hessenfarmer wrote:

Nordfriese wrote:

Perhaps the following interpretation is more intuitive? If a ware is needed somewhere and we don't have enough in stock, it will be produced. Always. If we don't need a ware, it will be produced until the desired amount is being stored in warehouses. A production ban would not be useful most of the time IMHO so I don't see the need to implement that.

me neither. I believe the settings is explained well in the Tutorials, so it should be clear what it does.

I have played also the economy tutorial again. It doesen't explain the "produce-on-demand" mode. Instead this tutorial does two things:

  1. It makes one feel the economy settings are very important, but in a real game it isn't.
  2. It shows how to handle the economy settings in a situation where ressources are plentyfully there. In real games this situation will likely not arise, because the one who produces wares on the limit (= turn every ware in shortest time into the needed ware), will likely win the game. A stock management (economy settings) isn't really needed.

Just to make it clear: I don't want to change the game, or some parts of it. I just write my thoughts.


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hessenfarmer
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Posted at: 2020-07-07, 22:19

kaputtnik wrote:

hessenfarmer wrote:

me neither. I believe the settings is explained well in the Tutorials, so it should be clear what it does.

I have played also the economy tutorial again. It doesen't explain the "produce-on-demand" mode. Instead this tutorial does two things:

Ok so we should update this a bit I suppose. Thanks for reevaluating.

  1. It makes one feel the economy settings are very important, but in a real game it isn't.
  2. It shows how to handle the economy settings in a situation where ressources are plentyfully there. In real games this situation will likely not arise, because the one who produces wares on the limit (= turn every ware in shortest time into the needed ware), will likely win the game. A stock management (economy settings) isn't really needed.

Here I disagree. there are situations where it is defi itly useful to produce for stock (at least the following).
1. Construction material should be stocked to a certain amount to allow for quick expansion if needed (having multiple construction sites at one time)
2. To produce intermediate wares if all ressources are available to save time once they are needed (e.g. rations, beer)
3. If the space isn't sufficient to have a full production chain (e.g. scenario emp03)

Just to make it clear: I don't want to change the game, or some parts of it. I just write my thoughts.

Well as your thoughts are well argued they might lead to a change, at least they are valuable input to the discussion.


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