Currently Online

Latest Posts

Topic: widelands tournament 2019: subscriptions started

king_of_nowhere
Avatar
Joined: 2014-09-15, 18:35
Posts: 1307
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Posted at: 2019-06-14, 14:17

last two days to subscribe. I'll post the pairings on sunday afternoon, as I'll be away in the evening


Top Quote
king_of_nowhere
Avatar
Joined: 2014-09-15, 18:35
Posts: 1307
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Posted at: 2019-06-15, 16:19

two pieces of news

first, notabilis volunteered to be final arbiter. Welcome to the team!

Second, I got convinced that perhaps crossriver artifacts is not an optimal choice, as on the small map the game would just be a very short race.

I've been looking for an alternate map for the artifact win condition, unfortunately i could find none. Either there is a single artifact in the middle, meaning it's just a race, or the artifacts are evenly split among the players and have to be conquered, meaning it's basically autocrat. I also discovered, most worringly, that several maps tagged for artifacts don't actually have any artifact in them. it's the case of three oasis (which I would have loved otherwise) and desert tournament.

I'm open for suggestions. Otherwise, I'd just edit three oasis to put some artifacts in it

Also, whoever cannot play the first turn (I think some people mentioned not being able to play all turns) should speak now, it will be easier to make the pairings knowing it in advance

Edited: 2019-06-15, 16:20
Top Quote
WorldSavior
Avatar
Joined: 2016-10-15, 04:10
Posts: 1135
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: GER
Posted at: 2019-06-15, 16:41

king_of_nowhere wrote:

two pieces of news

first, notabilis volunteered to be final arbiter. Welcome to the team!

Second, I got convinced that perhaps crossriver artifacts is not an optimal choice, as on the small map the game would just be a very short race.

I've been looking for an alternate map for the artifact win condition, unfortunately i could find none. Either there is a single artifact in the middle, meaning it's just a race, or the artifacts are evenly split among the players and have to be conquered, meaning it's basically autocrat. I also discovered, most worringly, that several maps tagged for artifacts don't actually have any artifact in them. it's the case of three oasis (which I would have loved otherwise) and desert tournament.

I'm open for suggestions.

What about "Wisent Valley"? For me it looks like artifacts is anyway either a race or like autocrat but with strategical places at the map which decide the game.


“It's a threat to our planet to believe that someone else will save it.” - Robert Swan

Top Quote
king_of_nowhere
Avatar
Joined: 2014-09-15, 18:35
Posts: 1307
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Posted at: 2019-06-15, 18:03

I envision artifacts as a race with some fighting. That requires multiple fronts. In normal autocrat, you want to have a solid border on your opponent. You want to protect strongly your economy, while other parts of landd that you haven't built yet can easily be surrendered. You either build a small front to try and puush through to your opponent, or you build a large front and you try to harrass your opponent's borders where he is less defended.

iin artifacts, you have to push forward multiple fronts, and defend them long enough to get the majority of artifacts. this means that you cannot concentrate all your troops on a single part of the border, and an attack to a periphereal region that has no economy buildings on it can still be a large problem that cannot be solved by withdrawing.

wisent valley looks good for that, though it would work better for teams, so that all the artifacts would be contested. If I set up the players at opposite corners, then every one will get two easy artifacts, and then it becomes autocrat. If I set them up close, there is contest for getting some artifacts, but the players being close will still favor aggressive strategies. I mmay do that, though. Artifact race will be there if the front is stalled.


Top Quote
WorldSavior
Avatar
Joined: 2016-10-15, 04:10
Posts: 1135
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: GER
Posted at: 2019-06-15, 23:33

king_of_nowhere wrote:

iin artifacts, you have to push forward multiple fronts, and defend them long enough to get the majority of artifacts.

I wouldn't say that this is always the case. I can also imagine artifact matches where one fights only at one front, just like in autocrat...

wisent valley looks good for that, though it would work better for teams, so that all the artifacts would be contested. If I set up the players at opposite corners, then every one will get two easy artifacts, and then it becomes autocrat.

I think that the difference should not be neglected (in artifacts it's enough to conquer the opponent's artifacts, which can be far from the headquarters, which have to be destroyed in autocrat)

..................

By the way, could anybody please open a bug report for attaching all replays or organize something similar?

Edited: 2019-06-15, 23:33

“It's a threat to our planet to believe that someone else will save it.” - Robert Swan

Top Quote
teppo
Joined: 2012-01-30, 09:42
Posts: 343
Ranking
Tribe Member
Posted at: 2019-06-16, 09:26

king_of_nowhere wrote:

wisent valley looks good for that, though it would work better for teams, so that all the artifacts would be contested. If I set up the players at opposite corners, then every one will get two easy artifacts, and then it becomes autocrat. If I set them up close, there is contest for getting some artifacts, but the players being close will still favor aggressive strategies. I mmay do that, though. Artifact race will be there if the front is stalled.

A single player can control multiple headquarters in multiplayer. Why wouldn't you assign two starting slots for each player, instead of just one? Blue&yellow vs. green&red?


Top Quote
WorldSavior
Avatar
Joined: 2016-10-15, 04:10
Posts: 1135
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: GER
Posted at: 2019-06-16, 10:44

teppo wrote:

king_of_nowhere wrote:

wisent valley looks good for that, though it would work better for teams, so that all the artifacts would be contested. If I set up the players at opposite corners, then every one will get two easy artifacts, and then it becomes autocrat. If I set them up close, there is contest for getting some artifacts, but the players being close will still favor aggressive strategies. I mmay do that, though. Artifact race will be there if the front is stalled.

A single player can control multiple headquarters in multiplayer. Why wouldn't you assign two starting slots for each player, instead of just one? Blue&yellow vs. green&red?

Maybe because it's rather stressfull to control several headquarters at once.


“It's a threat to our planet to believe that someone else will save it.” - Robert Swan

Top Quote
kaputtnik
Avatar
Joined: 2013-02-18, 20:48
Posts: 1702
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: Germany
Posted at: 2019-06-16, 10:58

Bug report for save games and replays: https://bugs.launchpad.net/widelands/+bug/1832981


Top Quote
WorldSavior
Avatar
Joined: 2016-10-15, 04:10
Posts: 1135
Ranking
One Elder of Players
Location: GER
Posted at: 2019-06-16, 11:03

kaputtnik wrote:

Bug report for save games and replays: https://bugs.launchpad.net/widelands/+bug/1832981

Thanks a lot. What kind or savegames should be uploaded there?


“It's a threat to our planet to believe that someone else will save it.” - Robert Swan

Top Quote
teppo
Joined: 2012-01-30, 09:42
Posts: 343
Ranking
Tribe Member
Posted at: 2019-06-16, 11:05

WorldSavior wrote:

A single player can control multiple headquarters in multiplayer. Why wouldn't you assign two starting slots for each player, instead of just one? Blue&yellow vs. green&red?

Maybe because it's rather stressfull to control several headquarters at once.

Playing in tournament is stressful to some no matter what. Different map and win conditions make it stressful anyway, yet nobody has questions those choices. Would be interesting to see how a many starting points turn turn out. Would everybody develop each HQ similarly? If not, would one HQ be an "expand and cause trouble" and the other a "make a hero-producing economy" site?


Top Quote